Protect The Asset E7- Ed Haynes - Taking Extreme Ownership

Welcome to the protect, the asset podcast, episode number seven. And today my guest is none other than Ed Haynes. Ed is the CEO and founder of coastal CrossFit, Hong Kong. He also runs an online group program called the process programming and he's the co-founder of earned athletics apparel.

How does this guy run three businesses, keep fit, manage your team, deliver a podcast, find time for a healthy work-life balance, and do so much.

I've known Ed since 2010, and I've watched his career grow from a distance. So it was great to reconnect with Ed and to hear about his career journey.

I was super inspired by so much of this conversation. And when I was going through trying to figure out the highlights, I was just highlighting everything.

There's so much to take away from this podcast.

We talk about leadership. We talk about extreme ownership. We talk about self-reflection, self-development, and we talk about company values. There are just so many gold nuggets throughout this conversation and I'll be listening to it multiple times. Anyway. I really hope you enjoy this episode.

Let's get stuck in.

Personally, I'm doing really well. I'm in a really great Headspace. The last two and a half years has for sure tested my resiliency as a human.

but I'm still here. I'm still thriving. So a bit of context, Hong Kong has, we essentially are kind of still dealing with COVID. And Hong Kong government has, basically, you know, implemented a zero COVID policy, so that.

And actually we're doing a really amazing job to be fair until Omicron, decided to rear its ugly head over here. And that just, you know, is obviously spread like wildfire. Like I pretty much did everywhere else in the world. But the government is still persistent on trying to maintain this zero COVID policy.

So, we have as a gym, we are currently in our fifth round of, business closure and we are, but, but that's, but it's not all doom and gloom. We are going to open up next Friday, which will have meant that we would have spent one quarter of 20, 22 closed as a gym for the fifth time. We are opening up again.

I don't think this is not the end of. COVID measures and all that, but for sure, it's been, it's been challenging, but I'm well, thank you. Stretch has a long, longer than that. So that's it, mate. Yeah. I want to get into that. Cause it must be a very stressful time for you as a business owner as for so many other people as well.

So it'd be awesome to hear about that. Just, just to go a bit deeper, man. Like what's going on in your world at the moment. Like there's so much, I see you on Instagram and see what you're up to. What, what, what's your career right now? What does it look like? Yeah. So, so coastal ever since I've known you, when we first I think did the Poliquin course, and I don't even know what year that was.

I was trying to remember too late. It was way back to probably 2000 and I don't know, 10, 11 maybe. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, so I'm the, I'm the owner of coastal fitness, which is now a, you know, we're just entering year 14, 2009 was where we first set up. So entering year 14 as a gym. So essentially what that is, it's a brick and mortar.

We've got an amazing facility here in Hong Kong. We're essentially an affiliates, but we don't necessarily identify solely with CrossFit. So we do, we're trying to conditioning facility, you know, lots of, lots of bias towards education group training individuals. All of that. So coastal fitness has been kind of the main thing, but in, at the start of COVID two and a half years ago, we launched our online program, which is a process programming, the process programming.

It was kind of five years in the works, but we didn't actually create an official business until COVID all kicked off. So essentially what the process program is, it's an online training platform. We've got six different group programs available, got a massive coaching team, who was kind of giving people feedback.

And we just basically building this global community via coaching individually in groups, but also we've started an affiliate program, where we basically have affiliate gyms who have now a part of the process programming and something in the pipeline, as we are building educational courses now, which has been something I've always wanted to do, but only now have kind of got the time and the energy and the resources to actually do it.

So that's super exciting. So those are the main two things that I spend most of my time doing. Two years ago also started a new business venture called earned athletic. So that was essentially went into a partnership with one of our members of one of my friends to, to explore the world of fitness apparel, which is something that was completely new to me.

It didn't really know anything about it. And has been really challenging. Also, I think, you know, starting an apparel business in the midst of a very challenging time for the world, where, you know, it's essentially e-commerce and we're supposed to be traveling around the world and meeting people and whatever, you know, a lot of that didn't happen.

So that's provided the same set of challenges. But that's also been a really interesting journey, but, you know, I would say that, you know, 99% of my energy and my passion lies in coaching people and education still. So cursed on the process premium, I mean, things, and athletic is just an interesting side hobby where I play much more of a supporting role, to the guy.

Alan who has many the CEO there? Yeah. That's one of the fitness models. I've seen your pictures. Yeah. I basically self-select myself to take all the photos that was no one else's choice, but myself and that fit. Right. I vote myself in exactly how you've got to look at, especially now with the task. Thank you.

Thank you. I'm giving it a go. Yeah. PVC starts later for some people, so it's better late than never. Yeah. That's it. Right. Do you think, do you think COVID was the thing that kicked really kick started? You know, the process plan for you, like actually forcing you to jump online and start to create this?

Or do you think that that would have happened at the same time? Anyway? Yeah. So actually before I do think COVID was a massive catalyst for so many things, actually. For, in terms of all my businesses, it really challenged us to. So look at best practices and look at how we can improve things and think about things that scalability and think about how we can provide value when you don't get to do in flight.

Face-to-face, you know, develop human relations and connections like we've become so accustomed to. So COVID, I'm always gonna look back on the years of COVID is, you know, somebody actually my best years as a human, I think there's so much growth has happened here and I'm going to be very thankful for COVID in many ways.

But for the process programming. So essentially before, before we officially created the process programming, I was actually already writing group programs, many for our affiliate here. But I was actually given that out for free. And I did that for about three and a half years. So I basically used my Instagram page and be like, Hey, I'm writing this group program.

If anyone would be interested in being a part of it, I'm going to give you access. Absolutely. For free. All I ask for in return is that you provided me a feedback on how we can make it better. And I want you to log all your results. Cause essentially what we were doing was the way the process program works is that sends you a semi individualized group program.

So we write the premium out there. We have lots of people following it, but we interpret all the data that comes in. And so the new training cycle, every nutrient cycle, the goals of the program or the advertiser programs all based upon the current subscribers. So this was kind of like my chance to really like find a way to make this work.

So I basically, I said she ran the process programming without calling the process stream for free for three years. And then, you know, when COVID hit, the catalyst was I wanted to provide something for the well to help the world in a time of. And obviously everyone had lost gems, Instagram and social media was amazing because those, those are people coming out and giving his free body weight workouts.

But I also knew that what people actually giving was whilst the intentions were fantastic, which was to help people. I also knew the stimulus was a really what people needed. Everyone was just doing high intensity stuff, smashing each other. And, you know, as you know, like, you know, the CrossFit space we've been doing that for years now, we already, we know that that's not necessarily the most sustainable or the most healthy means of fitness.

And it just is something I don't really kind of agree with entirely. As a health, as a health prescription. So basically what can we do for the world to help them out in these tough times? Basically, everyone had that Jim's taken away from him. Everyone's kind of trying to make, do with training at home with minimal equipment.

So we created the gymnast program to the gymnast program was essentially exactly what I'd been doing for our other group programs. It's five days of structured training a week. It was delivered on a platform where there was coach's notes. There was videos gave people the chance to log their scores and receive coaches feedback.

And so basically started this gym preeminent. The reason we were like, okay, we need a website verse. We need to like, get this out. We need to let the world know that this is here. It's not, we're not going to have a cost and that was going to do it for free. And so I was like, this is the time. This is where we're going to now create this online program, just to get this gymnast program out.

And we did. And like, it just, it was crazy. The uptake, we never did any paid promotions. It would never have done. And we still run it. So two and a half liters is still a completely free program. We have a coach who is in charge. It's not myself anymore kind of handed over the rain. So one of my other team members, she puts so much effort and time into it.

And like we have over four and a half thousand people around the world who are part of that community. Yep. And yeah, not everyone's logging scores every day, but you know, we've got, that's the kind of a network and it's just like every day, it's just slowly growing and growing and growing. So yeah, I guess COVID was the catalyst for creating the process and it all came from, you know, the gymnast program.

Yeah. Awesome. Sounds great. It seemed pressive how quickly you guys pivoted, like I think a lot of businesses when it hit, where like I've got to pivot and jump online, but you know, I think the foundations that you obviously had set up from that free program that you were already doing gave you that ability to pivot quickly.

And it sounds like you've made something pretty incredible there that people. Jump towards really? Yeah. Well, I think a big part of it as well was thinking about like our own community at coastal. Like, you know, all these guys we've been, we normally train with them five plus days a week, and these guys didn't have a gym to train anymore.

They didn't have a way to have structured training and receive coaches feedback. And we needed to find a way to keep our community integrated, which is universities. Most gyms just said, you know, cool workloads, we'll see you in a few months when the government lets us open again. And we were like, we can't do that.

Like, this is our family. We need to help these guys somehow. So a big, big driver for the demonstration was to create something actually for our community and for our members. But then it, you know, then we made the decision. That's actually, let's share this with the well, and so then it just, it just grew.

Yeah. Yeah. Wicked mate, wicked. I'm curious to know more about your time management skills might like you're doing so much, like there's so many different things going on. Tell us a little bit about how you go managing your time. Yeah. I think, if you kind of look at it from face value on something like social media, it looks like a, like how does this guy do run three businesses and do all of it?

I think, you know, behind every great business is a really great team. And you know, I think back 10, 10 years ago, maybe less eight years ago, when I think about what my role was at coastal, like I was doing everything I was like the accountant. I was the lawyer. I was like writting all the emails. I was writing the programs, educating the coaches, doing HR jobs.

And to be honest, I hated more than half of it. And I was really shit at more than half as well. So, you know, I think that's just the natural evolution of a business owner is that you start to, and it's not just a business. And I, I, we have the same policy with all of our employees as well. It's like constantly searching for the things that you're really good at and you're really passionate about and making sure those are the things you're actually doing on a daily basis.

And so, you know, that's essentially what. The business career has looked like it's constantly asking myself, what do I want to be doing? What am I really good at? And like, let's make it. So I'm doing those things and the things I'm not good at, or the things I don't want to do there is someone out there who's really good at those things.

And who's better at managing those things and who loves doing that shit. And so, you know what I have now, I have an amazing team. This is just a bit of context. I have an amazing team who do a lot of the things that I don't like doing, or I'm not very good at, which allows me to be fully focused on the things that I think I'm good at.

And I really liked doing so, but I am a very regimented, a very structured person. And I've learned in recent years, you know, learning to be a little bit more balanced with it, you know, I think, I think, you know, coming into year 14 as a business owner now, and I would say that probably. 10 to 12 years, that was not balanced.

You know, there was like, there was, it was all in with work and coaching and self-development and self-growth, and I don't regret any of those. I think those are all really important years, but, you know, I think I'm at a point in life now where other things are important as well. Like, I, I love training in a gym.

I also want to get out and explore what my body can do, not in the gym. Like I want to get in the water. I want to play sports again. Like sports was really like the thing that I did forever. And then I kind of stopped it. Well, I guess cross it's a sport, but I just stopped playing and I stopped exploring, you know, I, I made a lot of sacrifices in those years, you know, perhaps I, social relationships didn't blossom the way they could have, maybe didn't travel and explore the world as much as I wanted everything was just so work-focused.

And I guess now I'm at a point where I'm just trying to find more balance with it all. So basically how my day is structured is that, I talk about my routines a lot. You know, I wait, I have pretty diligent, nighttime and morning routines that doesn't really change. I know that those are two fundamental parts, which allow me to be successful every single day.

And then yeah. You know, it's just like my goal every day is just to be deeply present in what I'm doing. And I generally find that my presence starts to waver for about three hours. So I can, I can go all in with jobs, tasks work, but after about two, three hours, I'm I feel concentration wavering or having to get myself up, force myself to focus.

I just stepped back now and I'm like, okay, now it's time for bed for break. Maybe I'll go outside and walk for 20 minutes or, you know, just get some sunshine. I love getting the sunshine or like, you know, catch up with some of my colleagues at work, you know, jump on a call or just like meditate and just sit in silence.

Actually, sometimes I do a lot that these days, But yeah. You know, what day is very regimented general protocols is that my day always starts with some form of work where I'm sat in front of a computer, whether it's programming, it's coaching, it's calls, it's thought creation, whatever it is, maybe it's recorded a podcast, but I always try to stack the most important, the most challenging things first in my day.

And then essentially the task and activity. Precede that, sorry, follow on from that. And the rest of the day of getting simpler and simpler and simpler, I guess the same way that you would look at, you know, training design and when writing a program, like you want to start with the most complex stuff, first, most challenging stuff first, and essentially it should get simpler as the day goes on or the session goes on and that's based exactly how I structure my days.

Yeah. That's great, mate. I'll bottle. All of that. While you just said there is sound advice for so many coaches, and there's so much in there, I one-arm pack unpack, rewind back to, you know, this team and, you know, create you creating this team. Like, I think so many business owners, like, like you said, yourself, you were taking on all the responsibilities, you would don't want all the work.

How did you let go of that? How did you just go, okay, I can let someone else do this. I don't have to be how my finger and everything. Yeah. Well it took a really long time and it took a lot of doing the wrong thing to realize that there was another way of doing it, you know, like. Thinking back to me as a person was very egotistical was very, you know, light control, refuse to delegate, wanted to be the face of everything.

And so basically what I'm saying is that like the way that I ran a business was just reflection of who I was as a person. And so what that leaves centers, I was just a very headstrong person. And I think a lot of people who get into running businesses are, and I always admire people who can get into running businesses and not have those, maybe not so nice aspects of, of being a human.

So anyway, I had all those, which is cool and, you know, life has been one big journey of trying to let go of those things and really trying to change myself as a person. And basically in a nutshell, the more I've developed myself and worked on myself as a person, the more my businesses and my relationships have flourished, but essentially it got to.

That was just a breath. That was a breaking point in my journey as a leader. And it probably came about seven years, six or seven years ago where, you know, coastal was successful. It was growing really fast. My team had gone from, you know, started with just me. Then it moved to three people. Then I moved to five people.

And the suddenly we had, I was running team meetings where like 12, 14 full-time employees. And I just didn't essentially have the skills or the, you know, the, I didn't have the skills to be able to run an efficient team, which was full of different personalities, different values, different experiences, different upbringings.

You know, I've been the way that my business started was like, it was three of us who were already good friends already. So like, I didn't have to have professional relationships. So to speak with these people, they were kind of like my rugby gym buddies, who I was also running a business with. And that's really who my entire social circle was before that point was basically like rugby gym buddies.

As more people started to join joined the team. I just realized that I just wasn't doing a good job anymore. And how I knew I wasn't doing a good job was that, you know, I was stressed out all the time of stress with like the people I was dealing with. I was thinking about like walking out for my business and just doing things by myself.

Like, why do I need other people it's too hard to have other people I could see that it was affecting my team. They weren't driven, they weren't motivated. They weren't doing the jobs that I really wanted to do. Staff were leaving, you know, and, and just, and I realized there was just a point in time, like, and I'm I'm, I mean, I know exactly when the point was, it was just one team meeting where we did professional development and I just basically lost it.

And I was. The fuck is wrong with you guys. Like don't you love what you do. What's wrong with you? Why don't you work harder? Why don't you do more? You know, like basically guys, why can't you be me? Was essentially what I was saying. Just ridiculous. Now I think about it. Yeah. But you know, that, that moment was really poignant.

And I remember I then had a two-week holiday where, I just had some space to just reflect and think, and up until that point, I'd taken ownership for a lot of things in my life. Like my own training and my own development as a person. But I also realized that I had a tendency to point the finger for a lot of other things in my life.

So when things aren't going well, it would be like your fault, his fault, her fault. And the book that I read that summer was extreme ownership by Jocko winning. Which is basically, you know, the concept that like take a ruthless approach to taking ownership for absolutely everything that happens in your life.

And I kind of read this book and my thought about the situation that I just dealt with before I went on holiday. And I was like, actually, I could trace every single one of these issues back to something that I've done or I haven't done. And essentially that was like, that was the changing point for me.

I ended up basically coming back from that summer to extreme ownership, absolutely everything. And that was really the catalyst for all the self-growth. It was like, okay, well, if this isn't going the way I want it to be, or I want this to be better, what could I have done better? Holy shit. Like I've got a lot of work to do.

And essentially, you know, that the next like three, four years was just constant discoveries of shortcomings of me as a person and realizing like there's work to do. And I need to put the work in for myself. And I said, she like. That's where everything began to flourish know I started to be able to create, develop, develop, and create better relationships with people.

The time the team got tighter, the team got closer. I started to speak to people more, understand people, more, invest more in the human relationships versus just thinking about growth as a company. And I would say now probably what makes our company unique is the relationships between the team that's super close and it always will be, you know, we do lots of things, I think on a weekly basis that are quite unique, that help bring that spring, our team closer all the time.

And the way that I always think about it is I have, I relate a lot back to sport thinking about playing rugby. And you're trying to think about like, when. When did I, when was I a part of a unit or a team where it was just like, we were just unbeatable. And every time I think about it was like, we were just, it was like 15 friends or to a seven, seven friends just willing to do anything for each other.

And that was like, that was a really special that's. That was always a real special recipe for what led to be in a successful team. And so I now take that and adopt that same philosophy with my team. It's like, I want to, I always say to, to. We need to be a championship winning to, to be a championship winning team.

We need every person within this team to be singing off the song song sheet, and, you know, to believe in the same values and to want to spend time with each other, not feel like they have to be forced to spend time with each other. And like, we're not there yet. We've got like lots of rock star players in the team, but like, we need the entire squad to be rock stars and that's just going to take time.

But that's the vision. And that's the goal of where I want to get to. That's incredible mate. So powerful and such a great realization to sort of have, because you know, my experience working in the gym and owning the gym as well. Like you say, coaches have all got their different values. Coaches have all got their different beliefs.

And when you're trying to stand up and be a leader and force them into line, it just doesn't work. You're just banging heads. So to be able to sit back and realize that, and to be able to help your team transition, to become rock stars, like you say, who worked together, that must be an incredible feeling.

I don't think the very, the very first part of that is like, you need to have values yourself. Like you can't expect for, to find a team of people who all align perfectly. If you haven't set what the standard is that you're looking for. And so, you know, going back to like why self-growth was so important is essentially that the values of my organizations now are essentially just my values.

It's the value of the six values. We call it the coastal six now, whereas actually the process sex or the earner sex as it kind of goes across every organization, I'm a part of, but those six values are the six values that I live in, govern my life by. And what we did, we basically put those values out there.

We, we printed on our walls and our gym. We put it on our social media, we put it on the website and said like, this is what makes a costal or a process person. And what started to happen was that people around the world would read those values and be like, Those are the same values that I live by. I want to be a part of that now.

And so rather than me having to change people or try and evolve people to adhere to values, people are now. Based on those values and say, those are the values that I love. This is also a passion of mine and a purpose of mine. How can I be a part of it? And, you know, that's, I think just having that clarity right from the start is such an essential key ingredient to building a good team.

Yeah, for sure. It's like surrounding yourself with the people you aligned with, like you say, you're not going to be 100% on the same page with your values, but if there's, you know, 80%, 75% in common, then they're the sort of people you want. And like not only your staff, like you say, the clients that you're working with to align your values with those guys, super, super, super powerful mate.

And I'm very impressed with, you know, the passion that you have behind that. Can I, can I ask what some of those values are? Yeah, yeah, for sure. So, being honest and humble is one of them and a lot of that, I mean, honesty, we all know what honesty is, but honesty is obviously being honest with yourself first and foremost, being honest with others, humbleness.

Being able to give feedback, but also receive feedback. Vulnerability is a super important one, which is essentially of being able to ask for help and not being afraid to ask for help. And obviously not being afraid to share your struggles. That's probably the most challenging one of all our values, because, you know, I certainly think back to my former self, I was not a vulnerable person at all, kept all my feelings and size sweats under the rug.

But you know, like now it's something I really, I really embrace on. Like everything I try and be as vulnerable as I can, even on things like social media, taking ownership, of course, that's one of the main ones for us. Having a growth mind. Growth mindset is essentially contrary to that growth mindset is a fixed mindset, which is basically I am the way I am and I'm never going to change.

Whereas the growth mindset embraces a fight that we can all change. And we have, we have power and control over that. A growth mindset, fixed mindset, being a good human is super important. Now I know that in that one is, that can be subjective and down to the eyes of a hold of it for things I miss just being courteous as being kind as being nice.

What else have we got? I should know these off the back of my hand. I'm pretty sure they've nailed all 600 or six there, mate. It's great. Yeah. So those are, those are, those are our six values. Yeah. Yeah. Where did those values come from? Did you just sit there and yourself and sort of think about your own values or was that a group effort of as a team to come up with those values where you're working with a business coach?

Like what made you actually sit down and go, you know what? I need to get my values clear. Yeah, I love the question because that was those values coming up. Those six values was probably the end of like a three-year project for me. And so the way I went about my even thought about values in the first place was cause every business book, every men's word I talked to was like, you need to have values.

All right. Okay. Well, let me make some values. Let me make some values that how the fuck do I make values? So I spent, you know, I spent a couple of years where I'd have team meetings where it'd be like value creation meetings, where we'd sit as a team, be like, okay. You know, tell me the things that you think are really important.

It's like you just get the same cliche answers, Amazon. You like you shouldn't judge people. Okay, cool. So right. You shouldn't judge people like, oh, you should be honest. Okay. Yeah. Like, honestly, I like that. I like that. You know, like you be nice to other humans. Cool. So it bended basically what happened.

I had like this spreadsheet of like 50 different things, which like, you know, every person could just probably less and guess what all 50 of those things. Basically like good human attributes. And now I'd like, you know, I go away and be like, yeah, I need to whittle this down to like 30. And so I'd like chop off 20 present the team, but what do we think?

And then we'll be like, oh yeah, yeah, yeah. That's quite good. And I'm like, fuck wipe, but no one's buying into this anyway. So like then it took it from 30 to 20 anyway, like this process, honestly, it went on for years trying to just, and I still have that spreadsheet, but it was just getting nowhere. And I was like, just put no one's buying into this.

And essentially the, the catalyst was again COVID and the Catholics was in our first round of closure. We obviously, you know, I think I'm a big believer that I challenge it. People show their true colors and challenging times. And we had a really challenging time for us, just like the rest of the world business had been closed.

Trying to think about how you can like pay your staff. How can you get your staff to be motivated, to provide value to people? What I started to realize was that within our team, and I knew a lot of these things already, but there was some people in my team who I was just like, okay, I love this person. I don't know why, but I just, I love this person.

I want to fast and be here forever. And I have other people wants him. I be like, okay, I just don't align with this person. I'm not sure what it is to keep on doing things that just frustrate me and give me, annoy me. Like they're toxic. They affect other people. And you just like, you don't, you can't really put a finger on what makes this person great.

And what makes this person not so great. And there was just literally this one day when I went home and I was trying to think about that question. I was just sitting on that, like, what is it that makes these people create and what makes it not what makes them not great. So I try to think about, you know, coming up with values, which essentially a governing principles for you to live your life as a really, really hard thing.

Cause there's millions, millions of things out that, that it could potentially be. But a much easier route that I took was like, okay, well, what do I not. And one of the things I really don't align with, what are the things? So I thought about those people that I didn't align with. I thought, what are the things that these guys girls do that frustrates me, angers me, annoys me, you know, affects other people negatively.

And so I started listing those things down and it was honestly in that exercise of rice down, the things that I didn't align with, or I didn't agree with that. I suddenly came up, honestly, within 30 minutes, these five or six values, it was like, it was amazing. It was like, and I had this whiteboard in my house and I was just scribbling away and it would start with like honesty and humbleness.

And it was like, I didn't need cheat sheet. I didn't need to Google like principles and values. These things are just like jumping out at me. And I kind of just sat down. I remember like just, I actually kind of gives me goosebumps thinking about that moment now because I came into the team, we had a team meeting the next day and you know, we're coming like one or two weeks into business closure.

And, you know, I came into this meeting with this whiteboard that I written up at home and I just propped up in front of the team and a big circle of people. And I was like, right. I've like, you know, looking at like, let me just talk to you guys about values. And I had these six values on this board. And the thing that said made this moment different to every other time we talked about values was that I had meaning behind every single value.

So I had my own story, which made honesty and humbleness special. I had my own story with. mad e taking ownership special. I had my own story as to why being a good human was important. And I relayed these stories, which made it personal to me. And so I kind of shared this story and I remember I was getting emotional, talking to my team about all this cause like it was really triggering some memories and thoughts.

And suddenly night as I was just talking, like just all this clarity was coming. Cause I was looking at these people in the room. That didn't align on suddenly. I was like, that's why I don't like you. That's why we don't align because you tick one of these boxes and you don't take five of them. That's why I love you because you take all six of these and that's why we're going to be friends forever.

You know? And it was like in this conversation and I'm in this meeting, I was like, this makes sense now, like this, all this, you know, I spent all these years, 10 years running this business and I finally now have almost like a black and white guideline as to what makes a great team member and what doesn't make a good suit.

It wasn't, you know, I'd, I'd hide people based on being like, oh yeah, I kind of like you and you've got like a good CV, like come and join a team and I'd fired people. Or I should say struggle to find people because I was just something that just told me, I didn't really like him, but I didn't really have grounds to let go of them.

It was like, you're kind of doing your job. You're making us money. So. Maybe I, and maybe it's not right that I get rid of you, but this is something about you. That's not quite right. And suddenly like in that meeting, tracing those values, it just all made sense to me. And like in the week, following that I basically finished after talking about these six values, I basically said, listen, you've now got three options.

Option. Number one is that you read these six options, you read these six values. And when you do a bit of introspection, you just know that you align with these six values. And if that's you then like, you've got nothing to worry about. We're going to be here forever. We're going to have a great time. If you're reading these values and you'll realizing shit, actually I don't align with all those values.

Then Rudy, you've got two options. Number one, let's sit down together and let's create a plan to evolve you, to change you, to get you to understand these values and maybe one day you'll embrace the values or option two is that you realize you just don't align with. But there's a door you can leave right now.

And I'd never said anything like, like that before, but it was just easy. And I remember the team just sat there, like, you know, jaws dropping, being like, what the fuck. And I had, you know, you could just see on the faces of the people, the people who align with the virus were like, yes, yes, yes. This is what I've been waiting for.

The people who were questioning. You know, and realizing there were parts of his guys that they didn't agree with or realize that they'd fallen short with now thinking like, what do I do? Do I really want to be a part of this? And therefore, am I willing to make the steps to change and evolve as a person?

Or they're like, this just isn't for me. And so, you know, that next week or so I sat down with quite a lot of people who realized I basically gave, it, said I left it to them. I obviously knew who the people were, who didn't, who didn't align. And I said, you know, I'm going to be available to sit down and talk to you guys whenever you want.

We can just have a talk about it. Funnily enough. Like a couple of those people came forward, who I expect has come forward. We had a conversation and you know, those people are now still a part of the team and an amazing contributors to the community and have liked them so much self growth and evolution.

And now was a few people who I knew I was waiting to hear back from that just never came forward. And you know, we essentially ended up letting those people go probably in next week or. And that was all the evolution for the team that we have now, you know, those values. And now I hire based on values and I fire based on that.

And this team is all about values, like, you know, CVS and experience kind of important, but I also know we can teach, we can teach people how to write programs and how to be a great coach. But if at the, at the base and the fundamentals are all of it, if we just don't align as human beings, it's just never going to work because that's the type of team and that's the type of company I want to build.

Awesome. So great mates. So great. Just inspiring to hear you stand up there and be vulnerable in front of your team. Like leadership really takes. That courage. And it's impressive to see that you've got that courage to stand up there and put it on the table. It's not like you told them, get out the door, you sort of did, but in the reality you gave them the choice to get on board with what you're trying to build.

Or there is the door, your choice. And, you know, some guys have obviously come on board and had a growth mindset about changing that and those that haven't aligned, you know, it's given you that ability to let them go and to create a stronger team, which is so, so impressive because I think a lot of business owners really struggle to do that.

And the power of, you know, finding these values, even though it took you three years to get there has obviously helped you grow your business and the way you want to go, obviously getting rid of people, that's a hard thing. It's a hard task. Like what other things have you found to be really difficult in terms of being a business owner and being a leader?

Oh, so, I mean, like, just as hard as hiring, like, so just as hard as firing, like hiring is still so hard. You know, like trying to find someone in an interview process that aligns your values. Like it's still something that I'm not nailing yet. You know, like the interview process for us as like a five-step process now, which starts with, you know, a written application.

And then it's like a series of interviews which starts with me. And then it goes to other members of my team, which, you know, I'm guessing, gathering their opinions and their thoughts. And then it's like getting them into the environment and seeing what they're like with other human beings. Like, are you actually a good human?

Are you actually honest? Are you actually this, that and the other? And it's, you know, it's a long drawn out process. I really believe in the concept of like, you know, fire fast, hire, slow. But just to has the house slow, like I'm. Many of my highest is still not slow enough. What feels like it really drawn out long process.

I'm still sometimes still have, you know, the coach of the employee arrive on your doorstep. And you're like, no, still not quite I, how did I miss that? How did, how did that slip see the gaps? You know, I think so. I think, you know, Dealing with human beings is the hardest part of being a leader. I would say, you know, but it's also the beauty of what makes being a leader.

So amazing, is that, you know, you've got things like emotions and feelings, and there's big brain, which has changing all the time and all the people around you, which means that like, you have to be willing to invest the time into people. If you want to be a people organization, you know, sometimes you think it would be, maybe it'd be easier if we were all just robots and we didn't have.

This brain. And we could just, I could just hit the instructions on a keyboard and everyone just did it, but then I'd always be like, well, where's the fun and excitement and that, whereas like the beauty and like relationship building and, you know, like celebrating wins together and celebrating losses together.

Like, I love all of that it's but it's also, it's taxing and it's really tiring. And you've just got to be willing to put in the work to be able to do it because, you know, in the past though, I mean, I've always had a team as a starting business, but I had just been so focused on the work, the work being like coaching people that I didn't have the time and energy to think.

My employees or my team or my colleagues and I wasn't investing time into them. But I know now that like employees and team is actually the most important thing. Cause without them, like nothing else would exist. The clients wouldn't be there, the business wouldn't be there, the growth won't be then.

So like, those are your most important assets aside from yourself. And so, you know, I would say that just dealing with people is probably the hardest and most challenging thing that has ever been and will continue to be if this is the type of organization that I want to run, which is, you know, a people based organization.

Yeah. Yeah. I can see that, mate. I just definitely resonate with that. I think when you go from, like you said, having your own business and just taking care of yourself and your clients or your members to employing staff and then having to be a leader and manage that sort of stuff, it's such a tricky process.

And I think a lot of coaches who open gyms, don't think about that side of the picture. Sometimes you think it would be easier if I was just by myself. But then it's like, I just want, it's not the same, you know, there's so much beauty and being a part of a team. And like, I, you know, I love social connection.

I think human beings are very much wired to be social creatures and, you know, it's such an important, important part of happiness and fulfillment that. She, whilst it might be easier and a little bit less stressful at times to be by myself. I actually think that this is always what I want to have on.

I always wants to be surrounded. You know, you imagine, you know, the utopian dream, it's like just be surrounded by people who are exact think and live and breathe the exact same way as you, but we all have our own unique personalities and you just, and unlike even, you know, what I get to experience now every day is like, I get to hang out with people who I would actually, you know, I actually call them my friends.

And, you know, you read business books like, oh, you know, you know, you've got to have those clear lines between, you know, business, you know, professional and social don't blow those lines, or shit's going to get tricky. I might know if I can actually be friends with the people I work with. I think that's amazing.

Imagine going to work with your best mates every day, of course, there are challenging times because when you, when you need to discipline or what you need to have hard conversations, you still got to have that ability to do that, which I think I can do well, but. Yeah, that's the dream. Yeah, that's great, man.

You're building your own world. You're building your own universe and you're inviting the people that you want to be in that world to be around you. And obviously that gives you energy motivates you, keeps you on the path of your vision and your values, which is just incredible. You've mentioned, you mentioned back there before, like sacrifices that you've had to make.

Obviously you made a lot of sacrifices at the start of your career. And now moving into this leadership role is probably things you've had to sacrifice. What are they, what are the things you think you've had to sacrifice to get to where you are now? Yeah, I think like, even, even the word sacrifice is it's probably quite open to interpretation because I think when, when most people think about sacrifice, it means like they're not able to do the thing they really want to do because they're pursuing something else.

But actually now when I think about, I would say this. That in my eyes as very little sacrifice, because actually what I'm doing every day, the things that I actually want to be doing every day and like, I still wake up every single morning. We'd like, you know, fire in my belly to go. I cannot wait to dig into to these things.

I'm also very aware that those things may change tomorrow. And if they change tomorrow, then I'll have to reevaluate all of this and find what my new passion of our new purposes. So, but I think when most people, if you were to ask the people around me, like what does ed sacrifice on a daily basis? They would probably say like, you know, time spent with friends.

They'd probably think like social engagements, like alcohol and drinking and you know, partying. But I don't see those things as sacrifices anymore because like, those things actually take away from my ability to do things I really want to do. But. And I, but I think, you know, the, the question why a lot of people feel like they're a sacrifice when they pursue something challenging is because I think a lot of times people don't have the clarity on why they're doing something.

And one of the reason for that purpose, isn't, they're, we've not digging into the why and why you're pursuing something, then everything can feel like a sacrifice. I don't get to do the socializing. I don't get to do this. I don't get to do that because I have to do this. And I'm was like, you don't have to do anything.

Like we choose to do it. And if you choose to do it, then really it's not a sacrifice. But I, you know, I really encourage my, I encourage my team all the time, like dig into what it is that you want to do and make sure you have clarity on why you want to do it. And if at any point in time, those things changed from what you're doing yesterday.

Then let's have a conversation about it and let's, let's change what you're doing on a daily basis, but. Yeah, I guess, not so direct answer to your question on sacrifice, but I think it all comes down to like priority and purpose and why. Yeah, no, that's an awesome answer because it is, it's about clarity and it's about goals.

Usually when we set goals, there is that sacrifice, you know, clients see it as a sacrifice. If they've got to lose weight and they've got to go on a diet, I've got to sacrifice my favorite foods or whatever it is, but you know, how much do those goals mean to you? What is the why behind what you do? And to have that clarity is obviously a great way to look at it.

How often do you sit down and think about that? How often do you think about your goals, your visions, where you're taking your career, what's happening in your world? Yeah, I see, you know, I was just talking about this on our own podcasts. One of my coach the other day, I always get asked. So what's your, what's your one-year five-year ten-year vision.

I'm always like, I don't know. I have, honestly, I've never been someone to sit down and like map out, like even writing a business plan. I'm actually never written a business plan. You know, it's just, I'm very much I can live and live day to day. And this is perhaps a crutch your mind. Like, I think this is something I need to be better at is having at least a little bit more clarity as to what the future might look like.

But, you know, I'm very much like if I'm doing today, if what I'm doing today brings me fire and brings me passion and brings you fulfillment that I'm just gonna keep on doing it. And I very much know that if I'm doing those things every day, like. Great future destination awaits somewhere. They know what it's going to look like.

I dunno what it's, you know, what I'm going to be doing, but I just know if I'm doing the right thing and doing the good thing today, that it's going to lead to something really great in the future. And you know, that's proved to be true with everything that's happened so far when I'm doing the right thing and I'm doing and doing the good thing, like things do happen in your favor.

But you know, every, every now and then I do have moments of reflection where suddenly like, I have a bit more clarity in what I want the future to look like. Like, you know, it just actually just last week I just had this kind of an epiphany as to like what I want the future to look like now or what it might look like.

And, you know, there's certain things like sometimes I think about like my own life, like, where am I living? You know, right now I can see the sea is a really long way away from me and I'm really high up, but like, I want to eventually live on a beach where I can step out my front door every morning, get in the ocean, have a coffee with my feet in the sand.

Have a tiny little speed boat. I can take out and go fishing and go wake surfing like that. It's going to happen at some point in time. I don't know when it's going to happen or where it's going to be in the well, but it's going to be that. And it's going to be sunny. Of course. You know, I've learned a lot from this last two and a half years of.

Have, you know, your business being closed down for things outside of your control. When you have a brick and mortar, like a gym, like these things can happen. Like who's to say another pandemic is not going to happen again. You know, like your building could burn down, you know, someone could come and Rob every piece of gym equipment in your gym, that would be pretty impressive talk or something like that.

You know, like these things, these things can all happen. And it's really made me realize it's like, well, Oh, and then also, sorry, like, you know, what's happened the last two and a half years with like the growth of the process programming, which is essentially an online platform, which I love it. It's still kind of a part-time jobs.

I essentially have two full-time jobs at coastal and processes kind of it's their own entities. And eventually, like, I want to be all in with the process and I want to be really focusing on growing that in terms of education and training and helping people cause coastal, you know, as a business, you know, It's great like it, but it kind of runs itself.

Now. It doesn't mean that you don't need to keep on working on it and finding ways to improve. But, you know, I think that the time where I can hand over the range for someone else to come and be the head coach and for someone else to be, you know, the main person there is not probably that far away anymore now, you know, and I've just kind of just only just realized that.

So it's like, well, what, what does the future of the process program I'm going to be? I'm like, well, I want to have a process pre I mean headquarters somewhere, you know, where, you know, we're running classes, we're coaching people, but it's also like a home where all our athletes and clients around the world can come and train.

It's going to be in a nice location somewhere where it's kind of like a destination place where you can have some sun, you can swim, you get some water and you can live a really healthy, holistic life. Like that's what I want to have now. Cause I'm like, I can see that process for you. I mean, is, is growing bigger than coastal.

And it will continue to grow. And to be honest, the limits for growth are kind of endless because that's just kind of the nature of an online program. Whereas, you know, before we just got locked down four months ago, like we had a waiting list that coast that we actually couldn't get any more people into our doors to train.

And so we kind of maxed out its capacity and I'm sure, you know, we're going to have to do some rebuilding when we open up again now, but I want to get to that point again when we get to that point, like, what's next? What do we go? And so, you know, I don't really sit down and write plans and visions, but I am doing a lot of self-reflection all the time.

And the reflections are, is what I'm doing right now. Something that I really, really want to be doing, or is what I'm doing. Can it be improved and kind of change in which case that might lead to a thought in the future. And then, you know, I share that. I shared that with my team, you know, just the other day.

And you know, I think a lot of people will find that. Quite a scary task. Like you're telling your team that like maybe one day coastal fitness might not exist and there's going to be a process preemie, headquartered somewhere. You know, what about all their jobs? What are they going to do? But I'm, I want to let you guys know.

Cause some of you are gonna be licking your lips and be like, that's what I want somebody, like, I kind of just enjoyed a comfortable life, but just being a coach every single day, in which case, like. I don't know if maybe our time together is limited. I don't know. I'm not really sure. So yeah, that's my answer.

No, that's a great vision. And I think, you know, that vision is probably come from the experience that you've had now, you know, you've built this process plan and it's given you lot more freedom and it's given you a chance to sit back and question, you know what? I want to take this career and also to have such a strong team behind you, like, you know that if you were gonna leave the gym, you're leaving it in awesome hands.

You've got a great team you trust. And the members have obviously all look up to that team. So, you know, the hard work has paid off and you know, maybe it is time for you to sit back and enjoy life a little bit more like, yeah, I don't know. I mean, like, what I do know is that I want to. Yeah, it's funny. I just put an Instagram post up other day because I like to use my social media platform has just like a bit of a thought dump.

I never thought I liked writing, but I actually think now I actually quite, I do quite like writing and just sharing ideas. Maybe I'm not the best writer, but I would just put it down as I feel it. And as I see it, and the post was actually about trying to find a little more balance and essentially trying to work a little bit less and everyone was responding, going, ah, you know, I hope you're happy now that you've done this, this is really cool.

I'm like, no, no. I was really, really fucking happy the whole time and I've loved every day of it, but I'm just trying to, and you know, I want to enjoy other things as well as still being able to show up a hundred percent to my job. And that just means, you know, rather than working seven days a week, I want to try and work five days a week.

But in those five days I'm still going to be fully present, fully focused, you know, have intensity with what I'm doing, but I need those two days now to balance me out because I think as we get. Well, you got a little bit less resilient. You know, I still want my body to feel great every day. And I find more often than not my body doesn't feel great, probably just because of all the work load I do take on.

And when I don't get to train and express my physical body, the way that I want to, that gets me a little bit. Sometimes I'm like, how can I go? How can I be energized mentally and emotionally, but also, you know, like continue to see what my body can achieve. Physically, like, that's really what I want. I want like Optimus and everything.

And I realized that doing too much of any of those things is not going to allow me to do. Yeah, for sure. Mate, you've already mentioned some great habits that you've instilled. You talked about a morning routine. You've say you've got an evening routine that sort of sets you up. You're talking about writing and journaling.

Like that's a great way to obviously manage our thoughts and our stress. What other tools do you use? What have you found really helpful for you to stay on top of your mental health and on top of your career? So I think do two things. One of them, one of the amazing things is, you know, like honesty and vulnerability and being able to share that with other people.

So we have this thing at coastal again, to start it at the beginning of COVID, we have something called book club. And so book club is every Monday, the entire team gets together coaching team operations team. I've got some staff who live overseas now relocated, but they still work for us. And so people join in zoom calls.

We basically have this really, really crowded office. We need to get a bigger office at some point where basically we, we read a book, we read a chapter of a book or we listen to a podcast or we watch a Ted talk. Or we watch something on Netflix kind of changes every week, but something to do with like self-growth and self-development, and essentially we have 45 minutes allocated once a week where we just share.

And we just talk about what was interesting, how things related to us, and essentially what it has become, which we kind of laugh at when we put the time on it. It's basically become group therapy, right? We have this group therapy every week where we talk about this thing and we share our struggles and we share what's challenging us.

We share our wins, we share our losses. And, you know, I think that's something really, really powerful in being vulnerable, that deepening human connections and relationships. So the more we're vulnerable and the more we talk about the hard things, the closer we get as a team. But it's also. Yeah, it gives you a chance, gives every person, our team, a chance to like get what's on their chest, into an open platform.

So for a lot of my team, they don't like journaling, or they've never, haven't created the time to make generally work for them, but this is their form of generally the chance to just get their struggles off their chest. And, and even just, sometimes they're not, you know, not everyone in the team talks a lot of our team members just sit and listen.

But I know that just by listening to other people, sharing their struggles, there's bits and bobs that are relating to them and that's allowing them to grow and mature and develop as people as well. So I think having not every company has that. And actually I think so little companies have that, that connection or that.

Give their employees, the opportunity to share. And you know, this is something that's only started two and a half years ago and they say culture formation takes six years. So I'm like, holy, if we're only three years into this or two and a half years into, I'd love to see where we evolve to in six years.

But I think essentially having people call it your friends or your employees or your family, where you have that relationship, which allows you to be fully open and vulnerable, I think is a super, super important and really, really powerful thing when it comes to managing and dealing with mental health.

Like I meditate quite a lot. I actually started meditating in about 2016 when I was just couldn't I couldn't work out how to sleep well. And in hindsight, I know a lot of my sleep was cause I was just working way too much and just not really understanding the concept of stress, but I was kept on hearing, oh, meditation, this meditation that, so I started basically download the Headspace, started meditating like in its early days and I still have head Smiths now I still use.

Very very often I've explored other forms of meditation, essentially. It's just, you know, giving myself small periods of time throughout the day to just connect with myself and be deeply present. And that then allows me to bring that concept of being present into everything else that I'm doing. So, you know, I knew before this call, I was doing some work, just checking an opera Austrian community.

I knew that if I went straight from that jumping onto this call, my head was going to be a scramble based on the things that I've just been doing. And I'm trying to have this conversation with you. So, you know, every electronics away, quick five minutes and just breathing turn on the call. And like, I feel fully engaged in this conversation.

And if I'm going to go and train after this, which I will like, I'm going to need to take another little five minutes just to create that separation. So I would say. You know, having the ability to have those people to talk to and share openly with number one, super important, but number two, your meditation has been super powerful for me.

Yeah, that's incredible, man. I really, I really love that advice. A lot of the coaches that I talked to, so right now I'm working with a lot of coaches who are, you know, having an online business. And one of the biggest things that they say they miss is the interaction with their peers and interaction with other coaches.

They've just got no ability to connect and bounce ideas and just even have that banter. So it sounds like, you know, what you guys have done there with group therapy is definitely, a powerful sort of thing. That's great to hear. Is there anything else, like, it sounds like you're doing so much for the people around you.

It sounds like a great team with the values. It sounds awesome that you've got this group therapy thing. What, what other things are you, are you doing? Is there more, I think in a nutshell, You know, it's just constant investment in relationships. That's really, I know it sounds super easy and it sounds like surely there's got to be more than that, but it's like if people, if people feel loved and cared for, like, they'll give, they'll give anything to you.

And you think about like your best friends, your family members. And we say like, oh, we die. We die for these people. We do anything for them. My, you know, imagine having that same belief in your team and your culture. And so, you know, I, yeah, I really do believe it just investing in those relationships.

And it means that like putting time aside every month to jump on calls with, you know, members of my team who are now living in Australia and who now living in Thailand and it's like, I'm not catching up just the ticket box, but it's just like, just checking in and seeing how they're doing. And then like, you know, being a little bit vulnerable in a little bit honest, having a bit of a laugh, having some connection and just like, it's the same way when you think about, you know, as a coach, you know, how powerful checking in with your clients is, you know, like sometimes you forget because you're like, oh, you know, I have this, we worked with a lot of people were.

Well, you're not getting to have that face-to-face interaction with them. And so you think, you know, oh, if I give some feedback on a workout, you know, that's enough. They feel like the coach is there and checking in. But if you actually book in that, like monthly, 30 minute, 45 minute call with that client, just to chat about maybe nothing to do with training or.

At all, but just to have that connection and a conversation with someone have a bit of a laugh, you know, talk about some struggles, you know, what that does to the relationship. When you hang up that phone call suddenly like you've just connected through a deep level. And you know, like, I, I think it's such an important part.

It's why would the process premium, even though we have a group program, and if you look at most group programs around the world, it's like pre prescribed. You know, follow the program, I'll take your money call, see you later. That sounds terrible. I didn't didn't, I didn't mean to really bastard trading. I think it's group training generators in an amazing thing, but you know what?

I don't just want to be a training program which offers a training prescription. And you just go and do it in your own time. Like, I want to try to build this community somehow. And what we've found is that any way we can do that is everyone who joins the process pre I mean gets assigned to coach. Now everyone has joined the program, predatory free.

I mean, they're following one of six programs. So it generally is. But I think what makes it special is that, you know, knowing that you've got a coach checking in you everyday liking performances, giving you feedback, you know, it just creates that something little bit more, which makes that person want to be a part of this.

You know, it's more than just, and I used to think it was just about the training program and going back to staff, I used to think it was just give them a means to make money and they'll be happy, but it's not, you know, like we're human beings, we're complex creatures. Like we need connection. We need to feel gross.

We need to feel love. We need to feel support. We need guidance. And like, you know, essentially that's how my thinking, I guess, as a leader has evolved over the years, like you got to provide more, if you want to keep people for a really long time. Yes. Like they need to need to be able to have money, to pay for housing and feel like they're developing themselves and developing a career for themselves.

That's super important. They need to feel like they're progressing in some way, shape or form. But even with that. You know, not, not everyone wants to progress the same way. And I always used to see progression as like, you start as a group coach, then you become a personal trainer and then you start coaching people online, and then you become an educator.

And like, that is a, that is a progression of a coach, but it's actually not because no, a lot of people don't have any interest in becoming an educator. Some people just really love coaching group classes. That's why they're in a flow state and for the foreseeable future, that's all they want to be doing.

So I think, you know, just another part to what helps us keep this teams. It's just that constant questioning of what are you doing right now and is what you're doing right now, what you really want to be doing. And if it's not, let's talk about it. And it's just, it's constant. It's just constant redistribution of jobs, responsibilities, goals, and direction.

But I know, you know, so I, and so, you know, just now you've asked question now I'm thinking about philosophy. You know, we used to, I used to do a yearly review process. It was like, you know, the annual review, which is what every boss says. You know, every book says you have to do. The annual review. You sit down with your team and you basically, it's a fucking horrible meeting.

Cause you come in in knowing that you're gonna have to discipline this person. You're gonna, you know, you're going to sugar, coat the shit out of it. And to tell them they've done some good things, but really like everyone in that room is just wasting a few to deliver the shit they need to improve on.

They've got mass anxiety over it. Cause they're like, fuck, what have I done? What have I not done? What's he going to say? And so, you know, I did that for a long time. And then I was like, I basically said one day, a few years ago, I was like, I'm going to stop these annual reviews. They're horrible. Instead let's one of our values is going to be give feedback when feedback is G and when you receive feedback, receive it as a gift.

Okay, cool. So when I implemented this value, I was like, this is awesome. I don't need to do reviews anymore because if someone's performing well, I'm going to let them know the format well, and what I love about what they're doing and if someone is reminding or kick up the ass and something, I'll just give them that feedback.

But, you know, you just get into habits and you end up not giving feedback as often as it's you, cause you're a hundred other things to do. You end up giving feedback on superficial things, which is like, oh, you did a good job with that class. Or you did, you know, thanks for tiny on the weight plates where it's like, actually there are more important things as personally as received feedback on.

And so, you know, in the last year and a half, I've actually gone back to the review process, but rather than an annual review, you know, the concept of feedback, give feedback when it's due, that's still very much a part of what we do. And generally speaking, I think my team, we do it pretty well. We definitely still need to be better at it.

Some people still have that hesitant sometimes and giving people feedback cause a scared about the repercussions. Some people still don't receive feedback and tidy as a gift that may be a bit of an ego then. Well, there's some things that need a bit of unpacking, but generally speaking, we're pretty good at giving each other feedback rather than an annual review.

We do quarterly reviews now. So I have that set in my reminders. You know, every four months I need to sit down with my coaching team, even if it's just that two minutes and we just have a chat, like what's going well, what's not going well. Are you happy? You're not happy. What do we need to change? And like, that's such a, it's such an important part.

Every coach, every time I do it, there's always reaches out. I was like, I'm so happy we're doing this now. Like thank you for investing the time just to down and often I didn't really speak in those sessions. I just sit and listen. I've just got my, my notepad out or my laptop and I'm just making notes some.

Okay, cool. I think we need to make some changes here then. Is that sound good? Yes, let's do it. And so, you know, even though we're so tight knit, even though. We talk about, we feel like we can talk about almost anything with each other, having that still that official sit down. Let's just talk about work here and your job and how can we make that better for you is still super, super important.

And so that's going to be something I'll keep in forever and you know, that's, as the team grows, I'm aware that I'm going to have to start to create, you know, probably small subgroups of other leaders who are going to basically have their, have their own people that they've provide reviews for, you know, I've got an amazing general manager.

She looks after our operations team. So I don't do that review anymore. It used to, but now that's, that's under her jurisdiction. That will be something, you know, there's just this constant there's frequent scheduled touch points are really, really important. That's wicked mate, not so good. It's so good. I love the way that you're striving to improve stuff all the time.

It's not like, oh, we do a yearly review and that's how it's done. You're reflecting on it. Is this working? Is it making things better if it's not, you're changing it and it might work for a little while, but you're open to change it again. And it's just so great to see that adaptability or that flexibility and the structure and everything.

You've got all my it's been such an inspiring conversation. I love so much of what you've said as a leader. And I think so many people can learn a lot from the way, you know, you're running a business and the things you've sort of said today, mate, if people want to get in touch with you, if people want to find out more about the process plan, all this sort of stuff, where can they go?

Yeah. So the process, www dot the process pre. Basically everything you need is on there. We have different programs check out your pronouns, but I think most importantly, you know, don't just take my word for it. Do your research on who we are and make sure we align with what you actually want.

We've got things like prerequisites for all our pronouns, which we really are quite strict on. We, we, we really tell people, you must be able to meet those, to ensure your safety and progression. So just no caveat on that personally, probably Instagram would be the best. Ed on the score, hands on the score coach, you can send me questions or thoughts.

I really try and respond to apps. See everyone on there. Yeah, I'd say those are probably the two main places to find me. Awesome, mate. Thank you very much for your time today. It's greatly appreciated and yeah, it was such a powerful podcast just to hear all those great things. Cheers. Thank you strategy.

You know, it's actually really nice being on someone else's podcast. Cause we have our own podcast where I'm generally the host and it's always nice to actually have the questions for you. Cause then, you know, this is actually being almost like a form of therapy for me as well. Like it's just reminded me, you know, I've done a lot of reflecting already and put thoughts out there and it probably actually creates, it has a bit of a Tiffany is again just by talking to you.

So yeah, you're an amazing host straps and it's really good to connect again and thanks for, thanks for having me on this.